Aiden Clore, a graduate of the USF Master of Social Work program, brought a profound sense of empathy to his internship in an inpatient hospital — because he’s lived the experience himself. He began therapy in his teens to manage depression and spent time in residential treatment centers throughout his early adulthood. While pursuing his degree, Clore began to see his own experiences reflected in academic literature, sparking a deeper interest in the mental health field. After exploring paths in psychology and crisis counseling, he found his niche in leading group therapy where he draws on his lived experience to foster meaningful connections with patients, creating a safe and supportive spaces.
Aiden Clore, a graduate of the USF Master of Social Work program, brought a profound sense of empathy to his internship in an inpatient hospital — because he’s lived the experience himself. He began therapy in his teens to manage depression and spent time in residential treatment centers throughout his early adulthood. While pursuing his degree, Clore began to see his own experiences reflected in academic literature, sparking a deeper interest in the mental health field. After exploring paths in psychology and crisis counseling, he found his niche in leading group therapy where he draws on his lived experience to foster meaningful connections with patients, creating a safe and supportive spaces.
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Chris Groeber: Well, listeners, welcome back to the Remark-a-Bull Podcast. As you guys remember, the Remark-a-Bull Podcast was set up to talk to social workers and practitioners and students in the field a little bit about how the educational system has impacted them and what they've learned.
And so today I've got, probably, I'm going to be honest in the interest of full disclosure, somebody that I really, really like that I want to introduce you to and somebody that has been a real teacher for me. And so, I want to spend a little time with my friend and now colleague who's just … he's just recently graduated, Aiden Clore. Aiden, welcome to the podcast.
Aiden Clore: Hello. Welcome to me. Hello.
Chris: And so, Aiden, you, you just graduated, right? So how was that?
Aiden: It was fine. You know, I don't really know. I don't know exactly what you're supposed to feel when you graduate. It's cool. I'm glad to be done. I'll say that. Watching, having that, that nagging feeling that I should always be working on assignments, you know?
Chris: Yeah. It's a hard thing, I think, being an adult that cares about a grade. I always felt like that was a weird thing. You know, I'm a grown man who cares, you know, did I do well enough on that assignment? So, Aiden? Aiden, guys, let me tell you. You've heard me over and over, say, in these podcasts that talk about the concept of using learning as a coping mechanism.
And I want to say to you that I think Aiden embodies that phrase to me because he's had quite a journey. So, Aiden, do you want to just start out by telling people a little bit … and let me also say, too, guys … I'm going to post the connection video, which Aiden is very artistically gifted, and he was the editor and actual star of our video, so I'm going to post that. So, if you want to see who you're listening to, you can click on that video, and I'll post it on LinkedIn later on.
So, Aiden, tell us a little bit about your journey. You can start wherever you want to start. But why did you want to become a social worker? Kind of what manifested that in you? Tell us a little bit of your story.
Aiden: Yeah. So, I'll say that I had a lot of experience even very early on. You know, like I think like 15 was when I first entered like, some form of therapy, psychiatry, very early on. And just being interested and ... I think I've, actually, I, so I haven't worked with adolescents. Right? That was an, a population I initially didn’t want to work on. I think that is such, like, a crucial time for early intervention and getting people to be both, like, interested ... and I think I was such, like, a rebellious kid that trying to engage people and like separate yourself from like authority figures, for example, and be like, hey, I'm not an authority figure, you know, like I'm a I'm a therapist. You can talk to me. I'm not like your teacher or, you know, like in, you know. Because that was a big issue that I had. And I think that I formed a good connection with my therapist growing up, who I'm still, actually, in contact with today. I may work at that agency.
Chris: Oh, wow. So that therapist did something that made you want to do what they do. So, what were the kinds of things you saw in that person that really inspired you to complete this master's degree?
Aiden: Okay. Well, I think she was … first of all, she was kind of cool. You know, she's like a young person. She had a similar sense of humor. You know, she can be kind of dry. But she was able to engage with me in a way that was interesting. And I think it challenges a lot of, like, the preconceived notions that we have of, like, what a therapist or a social worker is, you know. We're exposed to so much, I see, like, bad portrayals of what therapy is in the media.
So just, you know, engaging and in a way that's more of like a conversation with someone who's not trying to just like, kind of bullshit. Can I cuss?
Chris: Yes, you can, go for it. I do, I do it.
Aiden: Right. You know, yeah. Just someone who's there to have a conversation with you as a human being especially, you know, like, as an adolescent, someone who is able to talk to you is like, as if you're an adult. You know, you're not, you know, you're pretty much an adult. You're close enough, right?
Chris: So, jump ahead. Jump ahead, then, with me a little bit. So, you decide. You graduate, you graduate, you're 15. You go through some troubles, right? How was how was undergrad for you?
Aiden: Difficult. So, in my first semester I had to medically withdraw. So, I was in and out of both, like psych wards and I went to, dual diagnosis residential treatment center, and I had to medically withdraw. I had issues at one university that I won't say they did not like me. And I believe the mental health and substance use stuff was a big part of that. So, it was all creating like a big issue, right? And education was highly valued in my family.
My mom has a PhD, my sister has a master’s, and my dad has an engineering computer science degree. So that was obviously like, like heavily emphasized to me at the time. So, I was there kind of begrudgingly, though, just to be completely frank because I didn't want to be alive. I, I thought of it was, was very pointless, because I didn't think I would be alive much longer.
Chris: So, what flipped for you? What flipped?
Aiden: So. It's a good question, right there. My early, especially like experience with depression and suicidality involved a lot of, like, various treatment, a lot of therapy. Again, like residential, inpatient visits, medication, just all types of things. And, I don't know, it gets … I feel like it's going to go like, on such a sidetrack, but I guess just the culmination of treatment over time, there was a point where I it was almost like a retrospective thing where I realized that, like, I didn't want to die anymore, which is both, like very exciting, like, oh my God, I don't want to die anymore. But then also very scary. Like, now I have to actually do something with my life.
Chris: Yeah, womp, womp, womp. So, so the whole time now you're, you're kind of, because you and I've talked a little about this, you're taking notes on yourself, right? Because you've got this therapist that was very impactful in your life. You've got this situation that’s your real life and you experience it. So, you've come around this corner, you go, okay, I've decided this. I'm not going to die anymore. So then what happened with the education? Is that when it took off for you?
Aiden: Yeah. So, I think I think a big point in my education that really took off, was I was trying to decide between computer science and at first, I wanted I was thinking maybe becoming a psychiatrist, because of the money. I was interested in the mental health field. Money was in psychiatry, so I was like, okay, maybe I'll do that. But I had some experiences, maybe with grades, where it was clear that, okay, medical school is probably not on the table, but I started taking more … so my undergraduate degrees in psychology. Right? So, I think it was after I got all the BS, you know, just general ed credits and I started actually getting more into the, the, more upper-level classes, like the electives, like something like abnormal psychology, and then getting into some of the courses like behavioral health. I remember taking quite a few substance abuse courses and then some stuff on trauma and stuff and that's really where I realized that, like, this is where I thrive. Because, all of a sudden, learning and doing school went from being like this uphill battle from like pushing up against a brick wall that I was just, like, struggling with all the time into something that, like, I was actually good at and I flowed through. Right?
It was something that I was interested in doing. Doing research for school and like digging through a bunch of stuff, that wasn't a burden. That was something that I actually wanted to do. And I think that was really the big turning point, where school started feeling less like a chore and something that was engaging in something that I actually wanted to do.
And I started getting, you know, my grades went from the, you know, I think I even got some, lord forbid, some C's, but from B's and then all of a sudden, you know, I was getting like A pluses because I realized … and professors started liking me. I don't know, I started engaging more in class like, that was when I realized like, oh, this is actually something that I want to do, something that feels natural and not something that I'm just doing because my parent, my mom, has a PhD and she wants me to go to school.
Chris: Do you think, did you start to see yourself in the coursework? I mean, you know, because you've got this kind of dual thing going on where you've got your life you've been living in the difficulties you've had, and then on top of it, now people are putting words to your experiences and there's science around your experiences. How was that for you when you began to see like that co-occurrence of those two things?
Aiden: That was the big thing. That was the reason I entered, the psych degree, also, to begin with. I remember I would always have people ask. Like, I'd tell them I have a psych degree and they'd be like, oh, are you analyzing me right now? And I was like, no, why would I be doing that? I do this to analyze myself, not to analyze anyone else. And then for research purposes ... so I guess I will go back a little bit. So, I had some substance use issues going on early on. I got clean at 18. And that was, you know, that's kind of an ongoing process, but it hasn't been on the forefront of my mind for a while, but what I mainly struggled with is bipolar disorder. And that has been an ongoing issue still up until I'm sure it might come up through grad school. You know, I had a couple hospitalizations, during that. It's something that I still deal with on a daily basis.
So, when I was in undergrad, doing more and more research on that was really what got me more interested, especially in research and learning the methodology and stuff and learning more about myself, seeing my own experiences reflected in academic literature. Being able to identify things.
Chris: That had to be a little normalizing for you. Did that feel like, oh, okay, this isn't completely out of the blue?
Aiden: Yes. No. Exactly. Yeah. It was very, very normalizing. A lot of things made sense. Like apparently, I also happened to be colorblind. And I learned that that's a normal thing and like, bipolar disorder, and seeing that … and then like, just seeing all of the regular behaviors and stuff that, that all pop up. Because, you know, if you get an initial diagnosis or whatever, they give you a little pamphlet at the hospital or the psychiatrist or whatever, and then you just sort of get pushed on, but you don't learn a lot more about it. And so being able to see more and more things where it's like, oh, you know, like this is a big part of me and it does reflect a lot and all the things that I do, and this is in academic literature and blah, blah, blah.
Chris: That had to … I mean, I'm just saying that had to be really powerful for you and your family at that point in time to go, oh yeah, I learned about this. And yeah, this is completely normal, you know, and that had to be really it was that empowering because it feels like when you're talking about it, that, like, you had to have moments that were like super empowering because of that.
Aiden: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And I think, it can just sometimes get over into and yeah, yeah, it can almost get to a fault at times. Right? Because you can over identify with it. And then you're doing research and you can see that like, yeah, you know, this is … so then I'm like, oh well you almost like can self-manifest some certain things happening. And you're like, well this is a normal experience for some with bipolar disorder so therefore, I'm going to experience this. You know? But, in general, very empowering. You know, liberating. Good thing in general, you know, and that's good insight.
Chris: So, how long, how long between your psychology, your bachelor's degree, and when you decide to go back for a masters. What was the timeline?
Aiden: Oh, instantly. Yeah. I don't know if I was ready to be released back into the real world and find a job, but also, what are you going to do with the four-year psychology degree?
Chris: So, tell me then, why an MSW? Why? Why did you pick that?
Aiden: Well, you know, I think it was .. I've always been, like, very passionate politically also and advocacy wise. I think, obviously, you decide you want to do therapy. I ruled out psychiatry, and then I kind of started building up a little bit of resentment towards some psychiatrists based on my experience. So, nothing, nothing against them. But just the way that they go about treating, you know, clients or patients and the way that they are only able to meet with them.
Chris: Med management.
Aiden: Yeah, exactly. So, it's like, okay, I want to become a therapist. Right. And then what are the different degree paths you have? You know, like, you could do like USF rehabilitation, mental health counseling, you can do social work, you can go for a clinical, psychology degree. Social work also just happens to have a lot of the social justice and political aspect of it, which is something that I was very involved in. And then also I became involved in crisis counseling, which was a thing that I realized that I really didn't want to do. And that was kind of enlightening because it also showed me that or gave me some exposure to like, you know, like we'll say like vicarious trauma and a lot of, yeah.
Chris: Was that triggering it all to you? Like when you, when you saw people when they were really, really struggling and I mean, were you thrown back into those times when you really struggled?
Aiden: Yes. Yeah. So, it can be it was triggering in that way. And then just being it was specifically for LGBTQ youth and then, you know, going back into social work in our in our advocacy and stuff. But there's a lot of … as a crisis counselor, you’re so limited in what you're actually able to do. Like, you have people breathing down your neck all that was .. that I again, I could never do crisis.
Chris: A lot of pressure.
Aiden: Yeah. Yes. Yeah. So, it was it was generally just very draining. I dreaded doing it, which, you know, sucks in hindsight. Like, you know, every time I would have a shift coming up, I would just, like, spend time ruminating over like, oh my gosh. So, there was some realization that, like, maybe, there are going to be times where I'm not fit to maybe do this, which is just, or like, I may get too exhausted or burnt out from, like the actual counseling aspect of things.
And that's where another aspect of the social work degree comes into play, where it's like it's more versatile and there's a lot that I can do with it. Whereas if you get a counseling degree, you're going to counsel. Like, that's what you do, right? Right. So, with social work there's so much you can do.
Chris: So then talk to me a little bit then, because you and I've talked about this and I think this is really interesting. So, you, you you're doing placements in social work. Because in social work, we have, it is mostly placement based. Right? It's what they call the signature pedagogy of social work is having to be in placement. So, you're in these placements. Where did you do your placements?
Aiden: So, I was at an inpatient behavioral health unit in Tampa.
Chris: So what was that like being on the other side in an inpatient behavioral health unit? Based on your experience?
Aiden: It was interesting, right? Especially for the most recent time. So, I went, myself, back to a hospital, a few months ago now, and there was a period where I went from, you know, being a social worker in the unit to being a patient in the unit and back to a social worker with, like a few days between. Which is bizarre.
Chris: So how do you navigate that? So, talk about that.
Aiden: Well, it's almost … it's nice to be cared for. Right? So it was actually very, it's very liberating to go from being the one who has to seem like they have it all together, running group therapy sessions and being there for the patients, and then finally being able to just let go and say like, okay, like I need help now, you know, it's like, come help me.
It actually … it lets such a big, a lot of weight off your back of being like, okay, this is, this is my time to, to be helped. Right? And then having to jump back in, I think it was a little premature. Luckily my supervisor was she was great and very flexible, you know, and then so I mostly did like assessments and group therapy, but we made sure that like, hey, running group maybe a little too much right now so we'll just start with doing like assessments. And she was, you know, and she checked in with me, you know, supervision and stuff like that.
Chris: Talk about that, how … so when you reentered, right, when you reentered the professional Aiden, not the patient Aiden, but the professional Aiden, how do you reenter into that role? How did being the patient Aiden impact how you dealt with people coming in? I'm sure you learned stuff. So how did that impact how you did your work?
Aiden: Oh well, it always is going to reinforce that that empathy, first of all, and that connection with patients. And I think running group therapy especially, it's so important to view your patients or clients as people. Right? And I think if you can get isolated from that and view it as like, I'm the therapist, these are these are the patients, right?
Whereas if you go from being a patient in a group to all of a sudden being the therapist, it's much easier to just be, like, we are a group of people and I'm leading this group and I'm teaching people and I'm doing these things, but at the same time it's, like, this is just a group, right? And I think that can really help with the dynamic. It helps people feel like you're treating them like they're humans. Because that's one of the other things about being on the, you know, the professional side of a behavioral health unit is you do see some of like the mistreatment that patients will receive and the dehumanization and the infantilizing that other people do, which is also very difficult.
It can be like, you know, being in like interdisciplinary meetings and seeing how people will talk about patients, you know, and some of the language that they use. And, you know, it's like, well, they need … sometimes it's like comedic and people use comedy to cope because they're dealing with such serious, you know, you're hearing about just some of the most like traumatic and horrible stuff you've ever heard. And you're constantly have patients who want to kill themselves or, you know, completely caught up in delusions. But seeing the way that they are treated and talked about, especially from the social workers, are generally good, right? Good job, social workers. We would constantly complains about the techs. But, you know, they have the least amount of training al so.
Chris: And, and they'd get the most face time, right? Yeah. That's it. I was just on a call before this, and we were talking about the criticality of behavioral health techs and how they really run the mental health system in large part. But they get the least amount of training, they're paid the least and they get the most face time with people really experiencing difficult things. And so, they get trauma all over them. They get other people's trauma all over them. And I do feel for them. I mean, I really think about that group of people and I, I do have a heart for what they're trying to do. But I think, you’re right.
Aiden: So, like, okay, there was an instance where I was in this was actually a residential setting and I was having difficulty sleeping and they wanted to give me a certain sleeping medication that had already been on at another hospital. That sleep medication makes me psychotic. And I told them, and I said, I can't go on this medication. It makes me psychotic. And the psychiatrist was like, oh, maybe it'll be different this time. Yeah, yeah. And sure enough, it made me psychotic. And it's like I was a traumatize going experience in there.
And then of course the next day I'm like, well, guess what? You know, it's made me psychotic like we thought. And we see the same thing happen in our units. And I've been on that other end of it. And of course, the psychiatrist who have never had to take medication like this or never had to experience psychosis, they don't realize that, like you're essentially playing with like, trauma with someone, right?
Unfortunately, the psychiatrist carries so much weight in the behavioral health unit, they're like the end all be all. So, I'm kind of powerless in a lot of ways, especially as an intern.
Chris: But, so stop there for a second because you said a word. I mean, it keeps rolling around my head. Power. You know, there's such. I mean, what gosh, this is so interesting to me when you think about the power imbalance of being on one side versus the other, you know, being on the patient side versus being on the professional side when you when you sit where you're sitting now having this discussion with me, thinking about the power imbalance of those two things, tell me what's in your head about how you balance that power and does it? Does it make you? I guess the question is, does it make you like, so much more conscious on the professional side about how you use your power?
Aiden: Yes. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. And I I'll never forget it was one … there was … I was touring the facility in and I'm nervous and they asked me if I'm nervous about like, this was the behavioral health unit, and I'm not going to say who it was or whatever, but they said like, don't worry, because you can't screw these people up more than they're already screwed up. And that's another that's another example of, you know, how people will talk about the patients or whatever.
But that was something that really sat poorly with me, you know, and, you know, like, even as therapist as like, you know, luckily we're not playing with medications, but we do have, like this immense power over people and we do have this ability to make things worse, if for no other reason than like, especially at a behavioral health unit. These are a lot of people who are having like first-time psychotic episodes or something, and we are their first call with mental health treatment ever, period. Right? And us neglecting them or treating them poorly or whatever that can completely impact how they're going to interact with mental health in the future.
So, if you are bad, right, then you may delay this person, seeking treatment for another decade. And like, that's just one of the most obvious ways to me where it's like, yeah, we can do more harm than good. We do have this obligation to be competent, which is, you know, one of our whole big things, like, we need to be competent, we need to be compassionate, we need to be empathetic.
Chris: So, so when you think about your practice, you think about, you know, you're graduated, you're getting ready to go into to, you know, the gig full-time. How are some ways you think about when you think about this stuff and you think about your experiences, what are some things you want to employ to empower people that are on the that on the receiving end of your of your social work practice?
Aiden: Oh man, it's a good question in terms of, I think if I continue to be in like inpatient units, education on rights, even as someone who's been involuntarily held and then giving them, you know, being their conduit for, being their advocate for what they need and communicating, even though, you know, we're lowly social workers and are no psychiatrist.
What we put, what we tell the psychiatrist and put in notes and stuff can carry some weight.
Chris: But you're right. I stop there for a second because what we write about people, it's almost as bad a lot of times as what we say. Right? And so, somebody is coming on shift and they've not met you, and they're only reading the previous text notes or reading the previous social worker’s notes, a lot of times what we write is really, really important.
Aiden: Yeah. And I can't count how many times I've, like, you know … I'm big on writing, you know, patient was alert, oriented, calm, pleasant, cooperative, you know, like I’ll throw in a pleasant there. But I I have so many times and notes where they'll be like, patient was like, agitated or like aggressive, like guarded and then I go in and speak to them and they're like very pleasant and like, we're calm, cooperative and obviously things can happen. They could have had a, you know, their mood could have completely swung. But oftentimes it's like I'm going in there expecting a fight. Not literally, but … and they're actually very fine.
I don't, you know, like, violence risk, homicidal ideation. And then I go in and they're like, oh, these people are, they're very pleasant. So, but, I get to other people. You can definitely tell, some people who are maybe more jaded or whatever, they go in there and they go in, they're already in that like fight or flight. They're already there. Yeah. They've been activated. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So going in with an open mind.
I had one associate who for a while just didn't read notes at all, which is one approach. But I do think it's important to stay, you know, educated to know what's going on. But yeah. So I, I'm definitely I'm try to be conscious with what I write and also, you know, acknowledge, you know, keeping in mind that like, hey, they can also read these if they wanted to or like, you know, if it's ever comes up in like a lawsuit, you know, these can be read.
Chris: I want you to think just for a second about just the role of student. Right? So, you had all this going on in your personal life. You had this ... I'm sure there was a lot of fear, right? Am I going to trigger myself by doing, by even taking this class or … So, how did you navigate as a student, knowing that you had moments that were really, really emotionally and mentally difficult for you and moments that may have lasted two weeks? Right? So that really wasn't just a moment. It was a little more time. So how did you safety plan for yourself or navigate? If you if you were giving advice to somebody who has had experiences in the mental health system personally, and maybe, who knows, has a diagnosis or two, how would you advise them to go on and get their master's degree? Because it didn't stop you. You got your master's degree. How would you advise them to navigate that?
Aiden: Oh, that's a good question. I don't know if I dealt with it particularly well because I did let a lot of fear of the unknown … I think, well, I guess part of it is just persevering no matter what. But there were definitely instances where I was just, like, very afraid and not knowing how I'm going to be, you know, or it's like, I don't know if I'm going to be in the hospital next month, you know. Like, I don't know, there, there times, and just persevered no matter what.
Chris: How did I just say, how did you not let that paralyze you, though? Because a lot of people would be so anxious about that that it might paralyze them. How did you stop that from stopping you?
Aiden: I guess it. I guess … it's there's some tolerance of … or like, you know, tolerance of like ambivalence or you know, not knowing and like tolerance of not knowing and going on anyways. And just, luckily, you know, like I'm privileged enough that I, that I knew that like, I could get support if I absolutely needed it.
So, like this most recent hospitalization, though, I ran into something where it was in the middle of the semester. So, I had two during my grad school experience. The first one was over summer break, which I was doing summer semester, but I at least had some knowledge like, okay, these classes aren't absolutely necessary, so I can make them if I need to. But you did that. You did it, I did it.
Aiden: I was able to make them up.
Chris: But yeah, you but you got through it. Yes.
Adrian: Yeah, yeah. So, the second one was mid-semester and I really did not want to go because I was afraid of classes. Right? And that came up and I ultimately put it in someone else who's another student and I told him and I was like, I talked to him every day and sort of gave check ins and where I was and said, like, I'm going to let you make the call when you think I need, like, if I need to go to the hospital, then, like, it's going to be up to you now and I'll go forward with it, because I was terrified that I wasn't going to catch back up in the semester and for school and ultimately he made the call. I'm glad he did. But I don't know. There were times where I almost did, like, not seek help because I was afraid that I was going to get too far behind. And, ultimately, I was able to catch up. You know, I was gone for a week, and I went back and everyone was very understanding, like, you know, everything ended up being totally fine.
Chris: One of the, one of the things that I think is really important here that people hear is if your faculty don't know, they can't do anything to help you. So, it's really, really important that you communicate with your faculty members and that you've got a couple of champions that if you can't communicate with them, they can communicate with them, like your buddy you were talking about.
So, I think that's some good advice. Find somebody you trust that can kind of be your barometric read of, it's time to do something about this. And I gotcha. You know?
So, when you think back to this past two years, right? This master's degree, what is your … is there one great learning that you had? Was there an epiphany? Is there anything when you think about your future as a social worker? Is there anything that you want to hold on to as a moment that was really, really good for you?
Aiden: I think, well, and this isn't quite what we think of with like learning, I guess, but this past semester was really coming to the realization that, like, I can actually … so I've always known that I can do school … not always known, but up until, you know, like I said, that upper level of my undergraduate, I was aware that, like, as long as I'm interested in something in school, I can do it. I know that.
Chris: You're good at it. Not just do it, but you're good at it.
Aiden: Yeah, exactly. But I wasn't … I didn't know that I would be able to actually, you know, function as like a clinician. And this past semester, I felt like I reached a point where I was, like, not only do I think that I can function at it, but I think that I'm actually good at it. And just learning that and figuring out that like, oh, I carry value and stuff, that was so important. Right? And then in terms of like actual like tangible knowledge that I gained, hmm …
Chris: First off, let me just say that that is tangible knowledge, right? That you're good at it. I love that because one of the things I think as a faculty member, you want people to see their goodness, right? And you don't want them to feel like you're just blowing smoke and you want people to see, oh my gosh. And that's part of the reason I've been just dying to have this conversation with you, because I just know what you've meant to me. Watching your journey and watching how you did it and how you articulated yourself while you were going through it, I just thought it was so damn powerful to watch you just motor through and just implement safety plan after safety plan after safety plan just to meet your goal, which was to walk across that stage, which you just did. So, like, for me personally, this is just like, this is such a celebratory kind of moment for me to sit here with you and see how capable and how you really, like I said, you've embodied using learning as a coping mechanism. I mean, it's just … it's spectacular, really, in so many ways.
So, tell me, Aiden, what's next? Where do you go from here? You're graduated. You're a colleague now. You're my social work colleague. What are you going to do next?
Aiden: So unfortunately, I wanted to work at the agency that I interned at. But they don't have any positions. So, I guess applying is my next step. I’m going to be applying a bunch of places. Again, probably in inpatient units, maybe some, like, more of an intensive outpatient partial hospitalization, for which I think I'm good at running groups. I'm good at group therapy. I don't have much expressive individual therapy. So just doing that, we kind of talked about before that I would be interested in teaching some once I get, I'm sure I should at least get an LCSW first. But once I do that, maybe eventually a PhD, we'll see. You know, if I can swing the cost.
Chris: What about advocacy? You know, you mentioned that early on in the, in the podcast. Where are some place that you see lending your voice?
Aiden: I've been doing a lot of videos online, like TikTok and stuff on educational things and, you know, both involving like my own lived experience and then my education and stuff. And, you know, like I said, I'm interested. You know, I've always been pretty political and stuff. So. I'm, I'm vocal online.
Chris: Well, you know, there are avenues and we can talk about some of them offline because there's some people I want to introduce you to with regards to that, because I think your experience and your voice and your vulnerability to say, man, I didn't know if I could make it, but then I did. And then to be able to articulate … I love how you've always been able to articulate to me, like seminal moments where you knew things had changed.
Now, I I've watched your journey now for basically the two years you've been here and it I want to tell you, having watched it, I see such tremendous, like, thoughtful growth, like you took the opportunities that you had and you didn't just learn from the classroom or the book – you learned as you're been doing intake for yourself.
You know, in a Baker Act unit, you're thinking about how you're being treated and how you might treat somebody differently than that. And that's a powerful parallel process right there, my friend. I mean, that … I just … my hat's off. The other thing I want to mention – talk a little bit about your family and the supports from your family and what it's meant.
Aiden: Oh yeah, definitely. I think they've been immensely supportive. Absolutely. Like I said, they've always been very educated and stuff, but I know that my mom, in her childhood, you know, her dad was bipolar and struggled with alcoholism and stuff. She had to you know, she was kind of forced into being educated on that topic. And, you know, learning about that very early on.
But of course, that helped her know how to address me and get like early intervention. And she, you know, takes care of me, you know, and in ways that she can, you know. I do a lot. You know, I'm very self-sufficient, I'd say. But I, you know, like, she'll do things like refill my med box every week, you know, that's helpful. But, and, you know, like, when I last needed to go to the hospital, I called them up and was like, hey, I need to go. And they didn't give me any trouble about it. They're just like, all right, well, we'll meet you there type thing. They're someone I feel safe that I can check in with them and sort of tell them how I'm doing.
They don't love all the impulsive spending. So that is one. It's a good metric for, like, a manic episode where, like, hey, I spent like, $3,000 on credit card debt. And they don't love that. But …
Chris: But they love you, you know? That's … and it's unconditional because I … listeners, I've had the opportunity to work with Aiden's mom some and I just, as a parent myself, it's incredible to watch a parent walk this journey with their child and remain so unconditionally attached to who they are and, and who they are at the moment, and also the potential they have. And, so, you are a very fortunate man to have that kind of support. I will say, that's another real strength I think, for you, in addition to your ability to just learn, learn, learn, I think having parents that encourage that learning and not just encourage it, but celebrate it is it's been meaningful to watch.
So, I, I just could … and sometime I want to do a podcast with your mom about what it's like to have a kid who's going through these experiences because, a lot of parents, statistically, a lot of us do and your mother's an inspiration to me because she just she learned as you were learning. And it was so incredible to watch both of you use that whole concept of learning as a coping mechanism. Like I said, you all embody it to me.
Aiden, do you have any words of wisdom for the listeners? You know, any parting shots to me and words of encouragement you'd like to get maybe through somebody who's having an experience like yours and question whether I can get my MSW. Why would somebody who's got similar experiences to yours consider going on to graduate school?
Aiden: I think we can always use more, lived experience in the field. Absolutely. I think especially with, with like serious mental illness, I think substance use there made a lot of strides. We have a lot of like, like substance use counselors with lived experience stuff, which is fantastic, but especially with severe or serious mental illness. I think, again, a lot of … there's still a lot needed for compassion and empathy and understanding.
So especially, man, if we can, we can get more people with like schizophrenia and into, like into behavioral health units. That would just be so cool. And obviously, with that being said, you're likely going to struggle during graduate school. I think the MSW is probably a really good way to go because the workload itself is very manageable at least, you know, for me, but I'm, you know, pretty academically inclined. But the faculty and staff are so understanding, I think you just have to be open and tell them what you're going through. You have to be able to communicate. It can be kind of … it's not necessarily embarrassing, but it … I don't know …
Chris: It's vulnerable. There's a vulnerability there.
Aiden: Yeah. And it almost feels wrong to like, ask for accommodations for something and which is something that, you know, is bad. We shouldn't ever feel bad for asking for accommodations that are absolutely needed. But it's like asking for special treatment almost is what it feels like, where it's like. But, just be open, you know, and I've never had anybody give any pushback or anything like just people are very that's why it's such a good field to enter because everyone's very understanding, you know, it's like if you're you want social workers to be the ones …
Chris: Yeah.
Aiden: Yeah. Exactly. It's great. So just be open about what you're going through. This degree I think is very possible or it's very feasible, right? You'll learn a lot, but at the same time, the workload is very digestible and it's such a versatile degree, and it gets you your foot in the door in so many.
Chris: I agree with that. Yeah. Well, so I, I've had a lot of great students, but I just want to say how proud I am that, you know, you got the USF logo on your sheepskin and that just makes me really proud to know that. I just know how many lives are going to change and have changed just by being who you are and how you are.
And so I want you to know how proud I am to have walked a bit of this journey with you, and how thrilled and honored I am that you would sit down with me for this hour and kind of just kind of divulge your whole entire journey, which you've done, I think, very articulately and in a very uplifting kind of way.
So, I want to thank you, Aiden. And I'm, just again, I'm so very, very proud of just watching your journey. So, thanks for bringing us along. And well, guys, stay tuned. There's more folks out there that we're going to find and bring their stories to you. And, Aiden, you are in the truest sense of the word, absolutely remarkable.